Curse

whufc89 · Mar 19, 2008, 06:48 PM // 18:48

I've been using Norgu as a pure intterupt hero for quite some time now but was wondering whether it'd be better to use a ranger hero due to their increased armor & resistance to elemental damage.

They have higher armor etc but they may not be as good an interrupter as a mesmer. What do you guys think?

Thanks.

Shuuda · Mar 19, 2008, 06:51 PM // 18:51

Well:

Rangers have Broad Head Arrow, Epidemic and Volley which work nicely together. There's also Choking Gas builds, but they are very limiting, and suppassed by BHA.

Mesmers have Cry of Frustration, Cry Of Pain, which are both pretty good in PvE.

mHtt · Mar 19, 2008, 06:51 PM // 18:51

dont forget how much energy CoF, and CoP take ^^

i use pyre for this reason exactly

just hot key ur interrupt, and its like a 9th skill in ur bar.

i only bring mes interrupt to interrupt other mesmers...

Kyomi Tachibana · Mar 19, 2008, 06:57 PM // 18:57

Well, for heroes, I usually take a mesmer hero for interrupts, I run something more damaging on Ranger heroes, also considering that even though the Ai for BHA was improved, it still has a large chance of missing in the hands of a hero who isn't smart enough to close the distance between them and the target.

When actually playing my mesmer if I'm going dom, I usually only bring [skill]Power Spike[/skill] and [skill]Cry of Pain[/skill], as my interrupts, and they are rather good at making casters explode.

mHtt · Mar 19, 2008, 07:09 PM // 19:09

[skill:backfire] =best non elite for dealing wtih spellcasters

yesitsrob · Mar 19, 2008, 07:10 PM // 19:10

For human then it's ranger without question (Ranger/Mesmer is probably the best for epidemic for use with BHA)

Heroes are pretty bad with a lot of the ranger interrupts, doing nothing but spamming them on recharge and also being pretty terrible with BHA and Epidemic

Kyomi Tachibana · Mar 19, 2008, 07:22 PM // 19:22

Quote:

Originally Posted by mHtt

[skill:backfire] =best non elite for dealing wtih spellcasters

Please note I only said my interrupts.

And Backfire doesn't stop a Terrorweb Dryder from belting out a Meteor Shower now does it? ;3

Esoteric Mesmer · Mar 19, 2008, 07:30 PM // 19:30

As much as I love my Mesmer, I feel that my Ranger is a superior interupter. One thing I have noticed is that the hero rangers are very good at interupting, and the mesmer heros not as much. I also want to go as far to say that hero ranger interupters are better then most human ranger interupters, at least in my opinion.

the kurzick eater · Mar 19, 2008, 07:36 PM // 19:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by mHtt

[skill:backfire] =best non elite for dealing wtih spellcasters

backfire is ftl. the purpose of mesmers isn't to deal damage 99% of the time anyways.

this is about interrupting, not dealing damage whenever they cast something.

Div · Mar 19, 2008, 07:46 PM // 19:46

BHA > all. It turns cspace wammos into interrupting machines.

DarkSpirit · Mar 19, 2008, 07:55 PM // 19:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by the kurzick eater

backfire is ftl. the purpose of mesmers isn't to deal damage 99% of the time anyways.

this is about interrupting, not dealing damage whenever they cast something.

Although I dont really like backfire myself, I disagree that the purpose of mesmers is X and only X, the purpose of Ele is Y and only Y, etc. That is called build limitation sandboxing and promotes close-minded negativity instead of build creativity.

A mesmer should be free and smart enough to be anything that you need him or her to be.

There are pros and cons between ranger and mesmer interrupts.

- Rangers can cause dazed condition much easier
- Mesmers can interrupt pretty much anywhere they do not need line-of-sight. Ranger interrupts can be blocked through obstacles, or blocking skills

Flem · Mar 19, 2008, 08:17 PM // 20:17

Quote:

Originally Posted by DarkSpirit

Although I dont really like backfire myself, I disagree that the purpose of mesmers is X and only X, the purpose of Ele is Y and only Y, etc. That is called build limitation sandboxing and promotes close-minded negativity.

A mesmer should be free and smart enough to be anything that you need him or her to be.

There are pros and cons between ranger and mesmer interrupts.

- Rangers can cause dazed condition much easier
- Mesmers can interrupt pretty much anywhere they do not need line-of-sight. Ranger interrupts can be blocked through obstacles, or blocking skills

Great post.

Agreed.

Miska Bow · Mar 19, 2008, 08:42 PM // 20:42

In the Boreas Seabed mission in Faction i always take Gwen as full interupt. The end boss cant cast 1 single spell. When i get there i usually go get something to drink or to the bathroom and i let my heroes do the work. So far none of them reported me for leeching.

I play ranger and if i want some interupt i go with the awsome reflex of the AI and take Gwen. Currently finishing capping the south Shiverpeak and when i get to a group with a caster boss, i just lock her on to it while the rest of the team kills the others.

With good energy management, a good interupt mesmer hero can turn any casting boss into those dummies from Isle of the nameless almost forever.

whufc89 · Mar 19, 2008, 08:43 PM // 20:43

TY all, some good points been made in this thread.

Thanks again!

Schmerdro · Mar 19, 2008, 08:44 PM // 20:44

To add to what DarkSpirit said:

Mesmers interrupt in 0.25 seconds (or less because of Fast Casting) while Rangers interrupt in about 1 second (0.5 secs to cast the bow attack and a bit less than 0.5 secs for the arrow to reach the target). That's pretty significant when you try to interrupt spells like WoH which cast in 0.75 seconds.

Mesmers have Cry of Frustration, an In-The-Area interrupt with a somewhat long recharge, while Rangers have BHA+Epidemic+Volley or Chocking Gass which is much more spammable but unreliable/inflexible.

Rangers interrupt actions, while Mesmers usually interrupt Spells (i.e. they have few action/skill interrupts).

For my Hard Mode-ing, I always use a Mesmer hero (or a Necromancer with Mesmer interrupts) because they're more reliable and they do significant damage through Empathy.

Marverick · Mar 19, 2008, 09:38 PM // 21:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by Schmerdro

To add to what DarkSpirit said:

Mesmers interrupt in 0.25 seconds (or less because of Fast Casting) while Rangers interrupt in about 1 second (0.5 secs to cast the bow attack and a bit less than 0.5 secs for the arrow to reach the target). That's pretty significant when you try to interrupt spells like WoH which cast in 0.75 seconds.

Mesmers have Cry of Frustration, an In-The-Area interrupt with a somewhat long recharge, while Rangers have BHA+Epidemic+Volley or Chocking Gass which is much more spammable but unreliable/inflexible.

Rangers interrupt actions, while Mesmers usually interrupt Spells (i.e. they have few action/skill interrupts).

For my Hard Mode-ing, I always use a Mesmer hero (or a Necromancer with Mesmer interrupts) because they're more reliable and they do significant damage through Empathy.

Ranger interrupts activate in .25 seconds. A recurve has a flight time of 0.4 seconds at radar range. You should be able to interrupt 1s spells at full range, and 3/4s ones if you get a bit closer.

And [skill]Concussion Shot[/skill] > all

upier · Mar 19, 2008, 10:03 PM // 22:03

Quote:

Originally Posted by whufc89

I've been using Norgu as a pure intterupt hero for quite some time now but was wondering whether it'd be better to use a ranger hero due to their increased armor & resistance to elemental damage.

They have higher armor etc but they may not be as good an interrupter as a mesmer. What do you guys think?

Thanks.

Doesn't that strike you as a waste?

The ranger hero can bring something like BHA, Savage and Distracting. 3 skills out of which one will pretty much completely shutdown a foe. This still leaves room for quite some nice utility skills, damage skills AND the fact that the ranger isn't doing that bad damage by just attacking.
So for PvE where foes do not move and blocking is pretty much non-existent on casters - the ranger would be a VERY clear choice if there wasn't a one minor detail.
The heroes do not move when they are shooting though walls. Still - considering how the biggest baddies - where you need daze to hit the most are pretty much in plain sight - this isn't a complete deal breaker! Though it should give you something to think about before the important fight so that you at least check if the ranger is actually hitting the target.

Now the reason why I feel that a pure interrupter build is a waste - is because you could be doing more with your build. The mesmer has access to some very nice utility skills - such as hex and enchantment removal - so it's seriously a waste to just bring a full bar of interrupts. Especially since you are wasting a very useful hero slot on JUST that.
Of course the big problem with this is that heroes don't understand what skills aren't worth interrupting so they will just waste their interrupts on what could be useless skills. And that's the beauty of daze. Once the foes is dazed - you aren't wasting skills to interrupt them. Wanding interrupts them.

So I'll go with what was said:
1. pure interrupt mesmer build - I wouldn't go near it. it's a waste.
2. when dealing with better builds - daze just takes the cake. AND a ranger in a team has the option of even getting better if you build your team around it. Use a hero slot on an orders necro with a bunch of physical damage dealers, paragon buffs (which the ranger can also run!) - and the ranger really comes out as a winner.

itsvictor · Mar 19, 2008, 10:05 PM // 22:05

I don't need interrupts, I just blow things up before they hurt me <3. The only interrupts I use are knockdowns...

MasterSasori · Mar 19, 2008, 10:57 PM // 22:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by whufc89

They have higher armor etc but they may not be as good an interrupter as a mesmer.

The second part is highly debatable. There are pros and cons for both Mesmer and Ranger interrupts.

Ranger

Pro -

1. dshot and magebane extends interrupted skill's recharge and both nothing short of awesome
2. Relatively short recharge
3. BHA + Epidemic + Volley for AoE daze
4. All can interrupt skills

Con -

1. It is a physical attack. This means it can be blocked/avoided
2. A bit slower because the arrow needs to fly through the air

Mesmer

Pro -

1. .25 second cast is insane on heros
2. Lots of nice side effects such as energy gain
3. Frustration is AoE damage and interrupt

Con -

1. A large portion have slower recharge than ranger interrupts
2. Many interrupts are spell-specific and can't interrupt skills

Cebe · Mar 19, 2008, 11:18 PM // 23:18

I'd vote Ranger. As much as I love Mesmers, Rangers have Daze and faster-recharging interrupts than Mesmers. Getting line of sight is generally easy peasy, which is what Rangers rely on in order to be able to interrupt well. Rangers can also interrupt anything with almost all their interrupt skills. Most Ranger interrupts don't "do" as much as Mesmer interrupts. D-Shot being an exception, and Concussion Shot I suppose, though Concussion Shot's abiliy is reflected in it's energy cost.

Mesmers always seemed more "speciality interrupts". Mesmers do not need line of sight, so can hide behind a wall, and I guess to balance the fact that Mesmer interrupts "do" more they have a greater cost, recharge, and limitations. Mesmers can't daze outside of PvE skills, though they can Hex ith Migraine, Arcane Conundrum and the like. It's all a question of what you want I think.

In short, Rangers are a "stop them using it" interruptor. Mesmers are more of a "punish them for even thinking about using it" interruptor.

The reason to use a Mesmer hero over a Ranger hero is if you don't want Daze, and would rather have other skills at your disposal...I'm thinking Diversion, Enchantment Removal, Hex Removal and Fast-Cast Resurrector. Daze and higher armor Rangers give a party is often more tempting than Mesmer utility skills in my opinion. That being said, if any Mesmers have loaded up both Mesmer heroes and tried a "3 × Roaring Ether Setup" party...wow, it's pretty potent.